Quiz Time!

[cherry]

Let's say you are currently pursuing what is, to you, a new way of fannish expression.* Okay, so you've been pursuing it for a little bit now, but always in seekrit. Now, let's say that you've finished a project, in a fandom you are new to, and you really want to post it, but you can't quite find a beta. Say this is your second such project, but the first is at beta -- but you're still pretty sure you're really rather rubbish.

[Poll #905770]


* I have done fic, I have done static graphics, I haven't drawn in years, and I don't meta. I think you can all see where this is heading.

Comments

[sprat.livejournal.com]

If you know someone knowledgable in both seekrit-project-medium and seekrit-project-fandom (or even the broader niche of fandom it's part of) who might take a look at it, ask! I mean, I know--it's totally a scary thing to do, but if they say yes, you could end up learning stuff it might have taken ages to figure out on your own. It'd be worth it, right?

(I think posting as-is would be okay, too. Just, I'm no expert by any means, so I don't want to be advising you poorly.)

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

Research shows a few people who practice seekrit-project-medium or watch a lot of seekrit-project-medium who also have an interest (or icons of) the seekrit-project fandom.

But they are, unfortunately, amongst the most intimidating of the intimidating. Also, I have never had contact with them.

"Hi! You don't know me and we've never talked and you've never heard of me but will you beta ____ for me?"

Maybe I should stop being so unsure of myself?

[sprat.livejournal.com]

I think there's no harm in asking, you know? They might not respond, or they might say no...but there's always the chance that you'll catch them at a good time, and they'll feel like helping out a newbie. It's worth the risk.

*nodsnods*

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

Even if they weren't scary, I really wouldn't want to be annoying or rude. It turns out that a number of seekrit-project-medium people (and boy, is seekrit-project-medium really is quite tedious to type, is it not?) but haven't, uh, actually sent feedback to.

Seekrit-project-medium really are quite intimidating. Talent is silly that way.

I am maybe possibly thinking of working up my courage. *is so very cool*

[sprat.livejournal.com]

*cheerleads*

*totally doesn't judge you if you decide to just post this one and be done with it, however* *g*

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

On the one hand, there are bits that bug me and I do not know why, and I am pretty sure that if I post it as is, it will bother me later with its lack of quality.

But on the other, I would really just like to get something out there.

[livii.livejournal.com]

I voted for post-as-is, but I think you can make the first option work by just observing how the people you want to ask interact with fandom - are any of them friendly to newbies? Any of them seem to beta for a lot of people? That sort of thing.

If you're really lucky, you can post-as-is and get feedback/concrit from one of the people you'd like to beta for you, and in your reply you can say something about maybe getting their help next time.

Is it vidding? It's all I can think of. Seekrits!

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

The people I have pinpointed who are involved in the medium and have at least some passing interest in the fandom are just plain scary-good, yo. Then again, for all I know, I would be intimidating for someone looking for a fic beta. (Yeah right -- seriously, I doubt it. But you never know.)

I think as the fandom is obscure, there is a good chance that no one will watch it, so perhaps that is a plus?


Your guess at my seekrit is correct! Yay, you win a... um, you win the knowledge of knowing you were right.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

The thing is, with some people I would say, hey, just post it, but I think you're more likely to be pleased with the overall outcome after beta-ing.

Oh, and - if this is the secret-project kind of thing that I think it is, then I can tell you how to find a beta, or help you find one.

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

See, fic I can sometimes bring myself to post without beta, because I have practice with writing and it is easier for me to catch mistakes.

This current project is not one of the times I am loudly proclaiming that it just plain sucks (I am attempting to do this less in general, but I digress), there a some bits that I like but others that I don't quite, and I can't figure out why. It is niggling at the back of my brain.

It is indeed sort of secret project you are thinking of, assuming you are thinking what I'm thinking, Brain (but where will we find two buckets of mangoes and a drunken clown, narf?). If it wouldn't be a problem, it would be greatly appreciated if you could point me in the right direction, or help me find someone.

The slight problem with this is that the secret fandom in questions is Avatar: the Last Airbender. I refuse to feel ashamed.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

OMG, Avatar: the Last Airbender is everywhere suddenly. What is this mysterious new fandom?

Okay, the first person who comes to my mind here is elynross. She likes Avatar - she requested it for Yuletide - and she is an awesome, enthusiastic, and frequent Secret Project beta. I bet she can help you find someone even if she can't do it herself, and she is precisely the kind of helpful, kind fangirl who would help out.

So, do you want to ask her? Or would you rather I ask her? Either way! I stand ready to help, if you choose.

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

There are other non-teens who are Avatar fans? I picked up a few cool people during a friending meme, but other than that I have found no love. The thing about it, at least for me (http://cherryice.livejournal.com/178896.html), is that it has continuity, gorgeous world building, plot arcs, and OMG characterization. I really wish that most shows designed for adults had this depth of characterization. /squee

Do you think that elynross might be willing? We've never had any actual contact, but she seems very cool and very smart, but also very busy.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Oh, god, there are several other Avatar fans, even on my teeny default filter. I've seen it mentioned on my friends list by - um, hmmm. mecurtin, maybe? And a few others. People with kids seem to start watching it for the kids and end up watching it for themselves.

Elyn's usually busy, yup, but she's also usually willing to vid-beta, and even if she can't do it, she'll probably know of someone who can. And she's incredibly nice. And she likes Avatar, so she'll be interested in a vid for it.

So. Do you want me to ask her? Or will you? Because I want to see this Avatar vid, and you're much more likely to let other people see it if you have a vid-beta, so I am going to be pushy about getting you one.

And, oh, I wanted to ask you something. When you have time, could you beta-read two very short stories for me? They're SGA gen, and one of them is from season one and thus features Ford, so you seem like the ideal beta-reader. (I'm sorting through my folders and finding stories that I've finished but not posted. Well, obviously.)

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

You know, I had wondered how on earth you kept up with your flist -- filters would certainly explain it.

I wish I could say that I started watching Avatar with my little cousins, who I dote on, but I'm afraid I've just always had a fondness for children's cartoon, as my external drive will verify.

I am possibly going to have to start adding vidders and Avatar adults to my flist. (Seriously, though: vidders are scary.)

If you wouldn't mind asking elynross if she'd mind taking a look at it, it would be greatly appreciated. Someday, I will possibly have the courage to wander up to people I do not know and ask for beta, but today is not that day. Tomorrow is not looking too good, either.

Because I want to see this Avatar vid, and you're much more likely to let other people see it if you have a vid-beta, so I am going to be pushy about getting you one.

Hee. Well, this only is probably about a 3/5 at the moment, so its selling point for me is OMG AVATAR. Also, OMG, want to post something.

Thank you for all your help. You have no idea how much I appreciate it. *G*

And, oh, I wanted to ask you something. When you have time, could you beta-read two very short stories for me? They're SGA gen, and one of them is from season one and thus features Ford, so you seem like the ideal beta-reader. (I'm sorting through my folders and finding stories that I've finished but not posted. Well, obviously.)

I would love to. Send them on over whenever they're ready -- I'm out of town for most of next week, but I have some free time this week, and I should be able to get to them.

PS: At one point, you mentioned that if I were to be doing a super-extra-secret writing project that didn't involve the world 'fan,' you might be interested. Out of curiousity, and theoretically, does this still stand?

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

You know, I had wondered how on earth you kept up with your flist -- filters would certainly explain it.

*guilt* I don't. I use friending to let people know I've rec'd them, which wasn't the most brilliant idea I've ever had, but I was new to LJ and never expected to have many people reading my LJ or to have many people friended.

And then work got more complicated, and I just did not have time. So now I have a tight filter that I use every day, and then a larger one that I use when I have more time. And I try to check in with my whole friends list occasionally, but mostly I don't manage.

I am possibly going to have to start adding vidders and Avatar adults to my flist. (Seriously, though: vidders are scary.)

Not scary, really! I know they seem scary, but actually they are just, you know, fangirls. With mystical talents, yes, but still fangirls. (How's the other beta going, by the way?)

Someday, I will possibly have the courage to wander up to people I do not know and ask for beta, but today is not that day. Tomorrow is not looking too good, either.

*grins* Not a problem. I'll ask Elyn.

At one point, you mentioned that if I were to be doing a super-extra-secret writing project that didn't involve the world 'fan,' you might be interested. Out of curiousity, and theoretically, does this still stand?

It surely does!

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

... but I was new to LJ and never expected to have many people reading my LJ or to have many people friended.

Surprise!fame! It's the best kind.

And I try to check in with my whole friends list occasionally, but mostly I don't manage.

Your flist requires LJ to make use of its trained monkeys. I really don't think anyone can fault you for it. I am amazed you stumbled across this post, to be honest. *G*

Not scary, really! I know they seem scary, but actually they are just, you know, fangirls. With mystical talents, yes, but still fangirls. (How's the other beta going, by the way?)

Vidders just intimidate me, I guess. What with their mad-talent, technological know-how, and the fact that they all seem so bloody smart. It's just unfortunate that they also tend to be interesting enough that I really want to flist them.

Then again, for all I know, I am intimidating to newbie ficcers. I really, supremely doubt it, but you never know.

The other beta is still in progress. laurashapiro made it seventeen million times better, I think, but she suggested I have another person look at it before I release it, just because she knew what I was getting at, and had seen its various incarnations up until the current one.

*grins* Not a problem. I'll ask Elyn.

Merci beaucoup.

It surely does!

At this exact moment, it is still theoretical, but it is going to be my project for this term. Hopefully, I will be able to kick my own ass sufficiently.

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

Surprise!fame! It's the best kind.

*snicker*

What, I'm internet famous now? (Although I suppose by some standards I am. Best Beloved recently had this conversation with one of her employees:

Employee: ...And I'm really well-known on the internet, because of my journal that I do.
BB: Really?
Emp: And it's awful, because people get jealous of me and they're mean and it's not my fault I'm popular!
BB: Oh?
Emp: Yes! I have, like, sixty friends!
BB: ...Um.
Emp: And people can be so cruel to those who are more successful, you know?

And then BB went and locked herself in her office and called me to inform me that her employee was apparently experiencing an extreme burden of internet fame because of her record-setting number of 60 friends. And we boggled about that for a while, because - if 60 friends = internet famous, then I hardly know anyone who isn't.)

Your flist requires LJ to make use of its trained monkeys.

*dour look*

They aren't that well trained, either, let me tell you.

I really don't think anyone can fault you for it. I am amazed you stumbled across this post, to be honest.

Hon, you're on my teeny daily filter. If I miss a post you make, it's because I am completely away from my computer. (Or, more likely, at my computer, but weeping quietly over a federal grant form. Those federal grants, they eat up the hours.)

Vidders just intimidate me, I guess. What with their mad-talent, technological know-how, and the fact that they all seem so bloody smart. It's just unfortunate that they also tend to be interesting enough that I really want to flist them.

They intimidate the hell out of me, too. I mean, at least you can vid - I can't, and never will be able to, and half the time I don't even know what I'm supposed to be seeing when I watch a vid; I'm about the most non-visual a person can be and still have the use of her eyes. In general, I feel like I should keep my mouth shut in the presence of vidders.

But vidders are nice people, even though they do have many and scary talents. And the thing is, being afraid of vidders is counter-productive; it keeps you from making connections in the vidding community.

Whereas if you friend those people, and watch and comment on their vids, you'll make connections fairly quickly. (One advantage to the vid feedback problem: almost all vidders notice when you comment or send feedback, especially if you do it regularly. It's an easy way to get to know vidders.)

I mean, almost all the vidders I know I know from my vid feedback project last year. (Essentially, I forced myself to send feedback. It was, um, challenging, but it was also incredibly educational, both for what I learned about vidding and what I learned about vidders.) Laura's the exception to that - she beta-read my first Yuletide story, and was the person who pushed me into posting about vids, as opposed to just watching them in quiet wonderment. But otherwise, yeah. I pretty much met them all from sending feedback.

she suggested I have another person look at it before I release it, just because she knew what I was getting at, and had seen its various incarnations up until the current one.

...And, okay, I have to ask: have you had another person look at it yet? Is there an estimated release date? These are important things to know! I want to see it! *very nosey*

At this exact moment, it is still theoretical, but it is going to be my project for this term. Hopefully, I will be able to kick my own ass sufficiently.

Well, I'm here if (when!) you need me.

And now I must kick my own ass sufficiently to - *deep breath* - dig out those stories and send them to you.

It is amazing to me how hard I'll work to avoid letting other people see my stories. I am pathetic in that respect.

*boots up Auto-Ass-Kick-O-Rama Machine*

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

What, I'm internet famous now? (Although I suppose by some standards I am.

Famous, infamous, take your pick. But in all seriousness, I'd say that the majority of the fandoms you rec on a semi-regular basis know who you are. They're large fandoms. And if the people who have us flisted is about 10-20% of the people who know of us, you're rocking the 6,000-12,000 range. In your case, that might be conservative. By my standards, you're downright internet royalty. *G*

And we boggled about that for a while, because - if 60 friends = internet famous, then I hardly know anyone who isn't.)

Then I am famous, too! I demand people send me stickers. Stickers and stuffed animals.

Hon, you're on my teeny daily filter. If I miss a post you make, it's because I am completely away from my computer. (Or, more likely, at my computer, but weeping quietly over a federal grant form. Those federal grants, they eat up the hours.)

Aww. I feel special. If I had/used filters, you would be on mine, too. (Governmental forms are not fun to fill out. Sometimes, I think that actually being able to fill out university or governmental forms is the first test they set up.)

They intimidate the hell out of me, too. I mean, at least you can vid - I can't, and never will be able to, and half the time I don't even know what I'm supposed to be seeing when I watch a vid; I'm about the most non-visual a person can be and still have the use of her eyes. In general, I feel like I should keep my mouth shut in the presence of vidders.

Heh. Little bit of a difference between 'can' and 'attempt' but let's not split hairs.

OMG, sometimes, I watch vids that I've heard some talk about, and while I can admire them technically, I just can't quite follow the narrative. I am just not exactly sure what they are saying. It is very nice to know that I am not the only one, yay.

I mean, almost all the vidders I know I know from my vid feedback project last year. (Essentially, I forced myself to send feedback. It was, um, challenging, but it was also incredibly educational, both for what I learned about vidding and what I learned about vidders.)

My other problem is that I am just not good at feedback. I am trying to get better, but I always feel like I am being either effusive or vague. I am trying, though, because I know that I always preferred a single line of 'I liked this' to nothing when it came to fic. It is silly for me to be afraid to send fb, just like it is probably silly for me to be afraid to flist people before they flist me.

...And, okay, I have to ask: have you had another person look at it yet? Is there an estimated release date? These are important things to know! I want to see it! *very nosey*

It is sent off to someone else to have a look at, yes. She seems v. cool and v. talented. I think I might be causing a bit of a problem with my very random and very limited availability, because we're going to use Skype. It's just that three days of the week, I'm at school for 14 hours. The other two, it's 11, and I often work weekends. I am not an inconvenience at all.

... I kind of really want to have something finished and posted, because I haven't done anything fannish since August, yo.

Well, I'm here if (when!) you need me.

You are on The List. It is, indeed, a list Deserving of Capitals.

And now I must kick my own ass sufficiently to - *deep breath* - dig out those stories and send them to you.

It is amazing to me how hard I'll work to avoid letting other people see my stories. I am pathetic in that respect.

Send them on over at any time, hon. Like I said, I'm away at a conference for most of next week, but other than that, I'm free.

(I think that half of the reason I use betas is so that someone knows that something got finished, and kicks my ass if I don't post it, so I know what you mean about not wanting to show things to people.

Also, I am kind of terrified about actually releasing a vid. Of course, by 'kind of,' I mean 'very.')

[thefourthvine.livejournal.com]

And, yay! Elyn agreed to beta - and this is way cool, because she's one of the best there is, and she's beta'd so many of my favorite vids - and you should have an introductory email in your inbox from me and to both of you. (Let me know if you don't get it, or if there are problems of whatever nature.)

Now go do your mystical vidding stuff!

*cheers from the sidelines*

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

Hee! You really, really are a doll. Thank you ever so much. I've got the email, but I'm just reexporting the vid in question from FCP because I made a few minor edits. (If I'd know I was going to be vidding when I picked up my new comp, I would have pimped it out more to make this process less slow.)

because she's one of the best there is, and she's beta'd so many of my favorite vids

Aaaand now I'm afraid to show it to her, kthnx.

*excited*

*prods FCP some more*

[ex-thissuga.livejournal.com]

what ARE you doing? ;)

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

Shh, I am being discreet and not at all obvious. *deludes self*

[http://users.livejournal.com/_bounce_/]

Uhuh.

I originally voted 'post it now' but I may have been still logged in as my housemate, greenpea33. I'm leaning toward taking advantage of thefourthvine's contacts now. They said they know someone who betas your sekrit medium, right?

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

I wondered why greenpea33 had an opinion. (Hahah, your secret life as a sock puppet has been exposed.)

I think I am going to take advantage of thefourthvine and her contacts, because I know I will be happier with it if I've had someone who knows what they're doing take a look at it.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_bounce_/]

You are? Good. Because I think it's already a very good Sekrit Project and a beta might make it even better.

[cherryice.livejournal.com]

I would say that right now, it is a 2.5 or 3 out of five. Hopefully, with beta, I can get it up to a 4.

I do not obsessively rank things in my head, no.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_bounce_/]

Dude. *snugs* Good luck getting the beta. I'm looking forward to seeing the finished product.